Subject:Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Posted by: justifiedalive

Date:8/8/2002 3:36:52 PM

Lots of posts and threads regarding the rewire issue in Acid 4.0. Lots of posts and threads regarding turning acid into a super looper & multitrack solution. Well, I support SF in thier decisions and have a different sort of inquiry. I use Acid with Reason often. I use it in win98 with a software midi router called hubi. This allows me to use reason as a slave to Acid. I must admit, it doesnt function very well but is usefull at times. What I would like to know is if there is a way to have Acid slave to Vegas without third party wierdness. My song-writing formula involves both apps. As I am sure it does with many of you. I end up having to render Acid projects and import them into Vegas in order to finish compositions. This is a huge time waster and "file missing mind boggler" at times. Can anyone offer input on this one?

I should also clarify that I have only one PC and running the apps on seperate machines and locking is not an option at this time.

John

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:8/8/2002 4:46:47 PM

sounds like you need rewire afterall

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: nlamartina

Date:8/8/2002 5:16:31 PM

Justified,

What exactly are you trying to do? Explain your process step by step and what you're trying to accomplish by it. Some of us may be able to help you find a weakness in your work style if you're more specific.

Regards,
Nick LaMaritna

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: justifiedalive

Date:8/8/2002 6:38:36 PM

Sure thing. Recording process as follows:
1.Get general drums and various loops for inspiration in Acid. I make arrangement and save all media in folder.

2.Record Vocals, Bass, Guitar lines into Vegas. Before I do this I must first render in Acid a ref file to play to and import it into Vegas. And of course, set vegas timeline to match bpm for easy edits. All Vegas files go in it's appropriate folder.

3.Now for the rest of the project I have to bounce between apps. depending on what layer of the song I'm working on. Any time I make changes in Acid, Re-render for that ref in Vegas to multitrack to.

4.After completion I render the Acid file and do all final mixing in Vegas before mastering stereo 2track in Sforge.

The problem with this is that I constantly have to toggle between applications for adjustments. If I master and decide that beat from Latin Percussion is too loud, I have to open, re-render, import into Veg, mix, render, and master.

I also end up always archiving two file sets. One for Acid, and one for Vegas. Yes I am one of those guys who decides that lead I did at 5 am needs to be reopened and tweaked so I always keep all files in raw form.

I am trying to achieve sync between the two apps so that I can eliminate some of this work and keep the creativity flowing. And do all rendering in the very end.

Thanks again for any help and insight.

John

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: SHTUNOT

Date:8/8/2002 7:04:16 PM

This is the kind of workflow that the whole "rewire" thread is based on. This is what I suggested way back with the wishlists. I hate to say it but it looks like we can all expect it in the next release but for this one its a done deal with no rewire. You and me both will have to deal untill then...Unless acid 4 audio engine is Kickass and there won't be a need to open vegas to record mininmal amounts of audio:ie:vox,solos[guitar/vox/keys/]. In that respect then you'd only open vegas when you want to dump stuff from ADAT[more than 2 tracks] to vegas or recording drums,etc,then import into acid for mixing/mastering in soundforge. We'll see...BRING ON THE BETA!!!

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: waynegee

Date:8/8/2002 11:03:24 PM

SHUTNOT...no public beta. Private testing ONLY. The full product will hit shortly.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: Spot/DSE

Date:8/8/2002 11:26:15 PM

Why not use the Virtual Midi Router? We use it here all the time...

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:8/9/2002 1:27:13 AM

Try co-rendering with it.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: groovewerx

Date:8/9/2002 1:48:05 AM

why don't you just record all your tracks in acid and skip the toggling. a simple pc can get you close 10 stereo tracks. once you've laid the bulk of your tracks, render and drop it into vegas.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: justifiedalive

Date:8/9/2002 8:36:08 AM

Virtual midi router? Yes! Someone mentioned that to me before. But I know of no such function. Please elaborate. The gent who suggested it before hinted that it was an add-on on the Acid 3.0 cd. Well, I browsed my CD, and manual many times and see no such add-on. I am aware of the midi options under options. Is it there? Please elaborate on how to implement!

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: justifiedalive

Date:8/9/2002 9:12:54 AM

It is confirmed. I am an idiot. The VMR is in a folder called extras on the factory CD. Thank you for the tip. Any one using this feature have any tips on using it?

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:8/9/2002 10:19:51 AM

I have not used it. That's because I've read many posts in here describing what a nightmare it is, and even once you get it running, it's unreliable and sync-shy. Word to the wise. Plus you still have to mix to outboard as there's no co-rendering of audio, just midi control.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: buffalosnout

Date:8/9/2002 10:51:54 AM

Justifiedalive: Here is an old post of mine that may give you some useful information:

After a lot of trial and error, I finally got ACID and Cakewalk to sync up. Perhaps this procedure will sync with other MIDI devices, too.

To sync Cakewalk Pro 8.0 with ACID Pro 3.0g

In Cakewalk: Load a song in Cakewalk. Set the Tools Project Option (Clock) in Cakewalk to SMPTE 30 frames non-drop. You will have to set this Project setting for each different song that you want to sync with ACID. Be sure the Sonic Foundry VMR is selected as an “input device,” in the Tools “MIDI Devices” menu of Cakewalk.

In Acid: Install the Sonic Foundry Virtual MIDI Router in your operating system (Windows 2000, for example). Select Generate MIDI Timecode, not MIDI Clock, as your . Use the VMR (Virtual MIDI Router)as the Timecode generator, as set in the “Sync” preferences area. Also select SMPTE 30 frames non-drop. Make sure that none of the MIDI ports used by Cakewalk are activated (selected) inside the MIDI Preferences of ACID. If they are, you will get an error message that a selected device is being used by another program.

Go to Cakewalk hit rewind and play. You’ll get a message about waiting for a sync signal.

Go to ACID. Rewind and hit play. Enjoy. You now have LOTS more musical power than before.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: spesimen

Date:8/9/2002 11:58:51 AM

>>Go to ACID. Rewind and hit play. Enjoy.
>>You now have LOTS more musical power than before.

does that still work if the acid file is using looping or if you start messing around with mix levels and stuff in cake while it's running?

if anyone can get reason to sync with acid by using vmr, hubi, or midi-yoke, on win2k or later, please post about it!! with any combination i've tried it gets about as far as starting the apps at the same time, but then any adjustments or tweaks in either app results in drift, especially if your acid file loops. (which, since it is being focused as a looping tool, doesn't seem that out of line does it..?)

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: Jacose

Date:8/10/2002 1:50:52 PM

co-rendering is nessecary.. dont even bother with virtual midi router, it sucks goats.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: Maruuk

Date:8/10/2002 5:45:34 PM

You said it, jacose. BTW, just got my catalog and spent some time perusing the new 4.0 specs. Gotta say, not exactly an overwhelming set of innovative and useful features for $149. The piano roll editing isn't even integrated--you have to load it separately as part of that whole goofy Yamaha dongle. Yikes. SOFO needs us even worse than I thought. Send in the User Community Cavalry--Fort SOFO is under seige from without and within!

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: pwppch

Date:8/11/2002 1:46:02 AM

>>The piano roll editing isn't even integrated--you have to load it separately as part of that whole goofy Yamaha dongle. <

You are wrong. You don't have to load it sepererately.

Why do you call it a dongle?
What is goofy?

Peter

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: buffalosnout

Date:8/11/2002 11:41:59 PM

After a few nasty crashes, I no longer mess with Cakewalk at all while the song is playing. I, too, have noticed drift when editing in Acid while the song is playing, so my solution was just to edit while everything is stopped.

Subject:RE: Rewire not needed. Sync in SOFO is.

Reply by: aress

Date:8/13/2002 9:55:46 AM

record your overdubs in acid...

thats what we do...

or make a temp track, render it, and use that as a template in vegas, get your overdubs done, and re render the vegas work, and use that track in acid for your final mix....

what we really need is a robust SMPTE sync...