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Subject:Questions for SoFo
Posted by: waynegee
Date:8/26/2002 9:19:09 PM
OK, after beating on ACID 4 for quite a few hours I've come to this conclusion: It's pretty cool. Yeah, it's way buggy/crash-prone but the basic concept is good. SoFo is amazing with the ability to streamline a process we've all done for years and distill it down to absolute essentials in regards to UI, workflow, object model, etc. They've also managed to add on new (although not quite finshed) functionality that is very useful and also DOES NOT confuse or add additional complexity to the aforementioned workflow. Very impressive. Also, the latency (or lack of it with ASIO drivers kicks boo-tor). The response time is great(not so with WDM/MME though). Anyway, I have a few questions/thoughts/requests: 1) Is the OPT SDK public and if so, can one's creation be snapped into ACID 4.0 easily or does one need to know the ACID architecure as well? An example would be an OPT Rewire module(let's say, for the sake of NOT arguing...). An open architecture would be a productivity boon as well as possibly opening a cottage industry for developers. 2) Is there now or plans in the (near) future for hardware/controller support? I use Contour Pro now and while I find it indispensible (especially for tiny editing work), having faders, meters and the like would rock. I know that Radikal was working on SoFo support but they needed SoFo to integrate the functionality as well. Is this going to be a happening? 5.0, perhaps? 3) Meters. Need meters on each track. Gotta have 'em. I'm gonna go Maruuk-style on ya without 'em...every post, I'm gonna be up your asses about meters...lol("you're gonna burn in Hell with no meters"..."you're goin' down Enron style without meters"... that kind of stuff...lol). Seriously, I think they'd be very helpful in mixing, especially across the room or whatever. Probably not high on the list but think about it. All the Pro apps I seen have them. I know that they will add extra pull on the CPU but I think it's worth it. Maybe give the option to turn them off or on as needed. 4)A list of VSTi's that you have tested with and that you support. Maybe even a list of ones you are currently testing. Maybe even let us assist in testing...I, for one would be happy to do it. We are all shooting in the dark here as knowing what is supported. If we knew, we could avoid the trouble spots for now and not be sending you guys a thousand bug reports a day. Even the ones that were buggy in testing and didn't get ok'd...we'd like to know that as well. Same goes for plug-ins, DX's, etc. I'd like to avoid crashes and not wreck my kit if possible. 5) Even tho' you can nudge MIDI events around in the Track view, you can't nudge them in the MIDI editor. This functionality would rock as far as micro-editing goes. Think about it. 6) I really hate to bring this up but Sonar(boo. hiss.) has a tab where you can see just the FX, I/O and bus statuses in effect. This is great and BOON to productivity. Sometimes, if I don't remember what effect is where(which track, which buss, which assignable goes where, etc) I gotta go thru every track FX and find out...oof. Maybe I should write it down or something but in the heat, I just get rolling. With a lot of tracks, the hunt kills the flow. Please think about this as well. Maybe something as simple as a mouseover the FX button with a FX list in a pop-up. Or not. All in all, kudos...I think this is light years from where you were and if you get these few bugs ironed out, it could be a contender in the pro app race. Ya gotta get back in the press as a pro audio tool, though...get the word out. I had a client in my studio last week who bummed when he found out ACID was my main tool...until he saw me work with it. He was used to DP3 or ProTools/Mac studios and he couldn't believe the ease and functionality available...he said he'd hafta bend over backwards to do some of the editing and arranging in ProTools. He's ready to go PC now. I know you are trying to get into the video market but I don't think you should neglect the audio portion because you guys are genius at it and could own it, if you chose to. After all, the overwhelming success of the audio is what gives you the abilty to branch out. You might hafta split the audio and video divisions in half or make a sister company, similiar to Digidesign(audio) and Avid(video). Anyway, I thank you and I salute you. Keep up the great work. WG |
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Subject:RE: New views & questions...
Reply by: groovewerx
Date:8/26/2002 9:51:39 PM
would you have rushed to buy a4 if you had not won it in a contest? |
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Subject:RE: New views & questions...
Reply by: Maruuk
Date:8/26/2002 10:11:27 PM
Wayne&groov--You guys have a great attitude (a little levity goes a long way), and wayne, your detailed and helpful post there is a testament to your dedication and support of the product. You're right, Acid 4.0 will work, and the features will rock for us all. It may make no sense to me the way they're going about it, but they are going about SOMETHING, and whether we get to the promised land in a donkey cart or a limo makes little difference in the end. Acid folks who haven't been turned onto plug-in instruments yet (and that's a lot of folks) when it's all patched up you'll be blown away--it's very cool. And if we all decide the basic sonic purity of sound is improved in 4.0 (I need to hear more source loops to decide) that's a biggie. BTW, has SOFO officially announced a specific upgrade to the audio engine? There was some mention of it here from the helpers but then it sort of went away. I suggest non-tech folks who don't have the time or inclination to be beta guinea pigs ought to wait to get some of these new features rolling if they hit a brick wall with them--a lot of them are bugs that will be dealt with in a-f revs. Serenity Now! |
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Subject:RE: New views & questions...
Reply by: waynegee
Date:8/26/2002 10:23:00 PM
That's funny...I love have my integrity challenged. Anyway, the prize was a subscription in the SoFo Loop library and yes, I would've and yes, I wll when VV 4.0 comes out. |
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Subject:RE: New views & questions...
Reply by: aress
Date:8/27/2002 10:04:32 AM
I totally agree with waynegee.... V4 is great, with a few bugs... all i can say also, is the UI make my work go so fast even i cant believe it.... what used to take me hours tweaking samples for playback, now take me seconds... i just completed a project that would have taken me months before, were finished in 5 weeks.... i would also like meters, and a visual fx bus.... also SMPTE... |
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Subject:Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: Jacose
Date:8/27/2002 10:21:18 AM
How come your posts seem like complete sensless drivel and then you have something truly nice and for once logical to say every now and then? thx for the great post... maybe I wont ignore you yet. |
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Subject:RE: New views & questions...
Reply by: Jacose
Date:8/27/2002 10:23:51 AM
Im still on Acid 2, because i dont have any extra muula for Acid 4 yet, but Acid 4, even with its bugs, will be amazing to use with Vstis. I loaded a project I was doing in 2 and I was able to add A Kontakt Grand acoustic piano and It was so great being able to do that instead of making loops in Fruityloops and exporting them. I will teset the DEMO as much as possible, but the only problems I have found so far is TEmpo sync with Vstis and with fruity vsti. |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: Maruuk
Date:8/27/2002 1:20:45 PM
Heh heh, you just think it's drivel when you don't agree with it. Whatever happened to "I respect your opinion though I disagree?" Anyway, it's a sunny Summer's day and there are several beautiful women out there who haven't been kissed yet. Let's see, bugs or babes, bugs or babes...? |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: SHTUNOT
Date:8/27/2002 5:10:14 PM
1. Here is the thread for the info on OPT... http://www.sonicfoundry.com/forums/ShowMessage.asp?MessageID=114379&Replies=10&Page=6 2. You got my vote! I also use a contour shuttle pro and find it indespensible for work I do in Vegas/acid. I need to figure out how to make the jog shuttle wheel capable to "scrub" the audio as well. Do you know the settings? If not when I find out I'll post the settings. 3. I got flamed a while back for asking for a cpu meter/disk meter+ track meters. Again the whole arguement of taxing the code with so much "bells and whistles" that it makes the app drag. I love them in sonar though...but I do find myself turning stuff off to free up cpu power for plugins[When the HELL will UA come out with DX8 plugins already!] My work around would be to have the track in the "track list" that distorts turn "red". Do you really need to see the fluctuation of the volume in each track? Thats what zzzzapps the cpu because it has to keep it done all in "real time". How about leaving things the way they are and just tell us when its clipped...That way it frees up cpu cycles and all we have to do to is back off the volume. To bring the track back to the original color just click the "track number" of which is clipped. 6. Cool idea. Later. |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: SonyDennis
Date:8/27/2002 5:47:01 PM
> re: contour shuttle pro / I need to figure out how to make the jog shuttle wheel capable to "scrub" the audio as well. Do you know the settings? ACID does not have a vari-speed and reversable scrub like Vegas, but it can move the edit cursor at variable rates using the shuttle ring. The ACID settings that ship with the ShuttlePro do just that. As far as I know, Vegas & VideoFactory are the only editors that do vari-speed (with reverse) on the ShuttlePro. Would it be actually and seriously useful to do "vari-tempo" scrubbing in ACID? Hold to the right for "faster", hold to the left for "slower"? Spring return to center for "normal" tempo. No reverse, though. ///d@ |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: SHTUNOT
Date:8/27/2002 8:21:20 PM
You have a point...but what are the settings to make it "scrub" in vegas? Thanks. |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: Jacose
Date:8/27/2002 8:51:00 PM
Heh heh, you just think it's drivel when you don't agree with it. actaully, I truly think its usless drivel sometimes.. lol have phun m8 |
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Subject:RE: integrity
Reply by: groovewerx
Date:8/27/2002 10:41:49 PM
no challenge intended wayne... just curious. |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: waynegee
Date:8/28/2002 1:34:41 PM
oh yeah, and the ability to open/import an ACID project file into Vegas. If not that, then the ability to just drag a loop into Vegas from ACID...either would rock. Having to recreate the entire song is a vibe killer, for sho. Just think about it...If you can't, you can't. Thanx. |
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Subject:RE: Maruuk, why god why?
Reply by: SonyDennis
Date:8/28/2002 5:02:40 PM
SHTUNOT: > but what are the settings to make it "scrub" in vegas? Load the template that comes with the ShuttlePro or download the set of templates from their website. VV3 support is already in there, including vari-speed scrub. ///d@ |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: pwppch
Date:8/28/2002 5:10:49 PM
>>1) Is the OPT SDK public and if so, can one's creation be snapped into ACID 4.0 easily or does one need to know the ACID architecure as well? An example would be an OPT Rewire module(let's say, for the sake of NOT arguing...). An open architecture would be a productivity boon as well as possibly opening a cottage industry for developers. << ACID exposes Level 3 and Level 1 OPT plugins. Level 2 - FX processes - will appear once some OPT fx/processors appear. At the time ACID 4 shipped, none were available. As far as a ReWire OPT plug: No. This would be far beyond what OPT is designed for and the way ACID interacts with OPT plugs is at the ACID MIDI track level. The OPT Piano Roll and List Editor that are part of ACID 4 are limited to editing the "file" that is being used. >>2) Is there now or plans in the (near) future for hardware/controller support? I use Contour Pro now and while I find it indispensible (especially for tiny editing work), having faders, meters and the like would rock. I know that Radikal was working on SoFo support but they needed SoFo to integrate the functionality as well. Is this going to be a happening? 5.0, perhaps? << We are working with Yamaha to expand the OPT spec to define external control surfaces as part of the OPT spec. This is current work in progress. Peter |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: PHATDRUMS
Date:8/28/2002 5:17:54 PM
hardware control possibly inthe future that is nice to know i just wish it wasnt so far behind logic etc client s seem to love it some like the hands on they get even if it only for little touches and wresting away the power the the programmer has with the mouse its very boring sat at the back of the room trying to explain everything you want i guess |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: nlamartina
Date:8/28/2002 6:02:10 PM
Peter, Is it conceivable then that a Finale or Noteworthy OPT plugin could be developed that would allow us to edit track MIDI files using standard notation, or at least "dock" with said programs? - Nick |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: Spirit
Date:8/29/2002 12:12:46 AM
Hey Phatdrums, maybe you could be a reseller and "bundle" a copy in with studio time ;) |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: PHATDRUMS
Date:8/29/2002 2:15:29 AM
pity sofo cant reprogram charisma bypasses eh spirit ! |
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Subject:RE: Questions for SoFo
Reply by: pwppch
Date:8/29/2002 4:49:09 PM
Yes. This would be very cool, though I would expect the ACID community at large would prefer a really focused pattern based editor. Peter |