Subject:Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Posted by: Fingers

Date:4/27/2010 5:36:34 PM

I've been editing in a .frg file (24-bit, 96 kHz, but I've made so many edits that the .frg directory for a 1-hour recording is up to 20.1 GB. I'd like to save in a format that supports 24-bit, 96 KHz, but without all the edit history. SF 8.0 won't let me save to a PCM (.wav) file. I don't know how to rid the .frg file of all the edit history. Any suggestions?

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: Chienworks

Date:4/27/2010 5:54:06 PM

Why won't it let you save? What does it tell you?

I've never worked with .frg files, so i'm not up on how the workflow differs. Sorry.

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: Fingers

Date:4/27/2010 7:45:04 PM

First, if you try "Save" or "Save As", your only option is .frg. If you try "Render as" and try to use PCM (.wav), it errors, reporting that the file is too large for this format.

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:4/27/2010 8:22:29 PM

If the file is too large to render as WAV, render as WAV 64.

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: Fingers

Date:4/28/2010 7:04:43 AM

Thanks--that works fine. Using Sony W64 format.

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: MarkWWW

Date:4/28/2010 1:25:03 PM

Yes, the spec for a .wav file, as published by Microsoft, defines the chunk size as a signed 32-bit value, which means that the maximum amount of data the data chunk can contain is 2GB. For 24-bit, 96kHz, stereo this works out at a maximum of just over one hour. Actually, having a signed value for the chunk size is daft and it would be more sensible to use an unsigned 32-bit value which would allow up to 4GB of data, corresponding to just over 2 hours at 24/96. Most audio software will handle these 4GB .wavs OK, but some programs are fussy and will object to anything bigger than 2GB so it is safest not to use this kind of wav if you need to share them to anyone else. Sound Forge can be set to create this kind of .wav by ticking the "Allow Wave renders up to 4GB" box under Options|Preferences|General.

But as the others have said, the easiest solution is to use the .w64 format which was invented specifically to avoid this limitation of the .wav format. The .w64 format is almost the same as the .wav format except that the chunk sizes are given by unsigned 64-bit values which allow enormously long durations, even at 96kHz or higher sampling rates. (By my reckoning, at 24/96 the maximum duration of a w64 file is about half a million years.) But not all audio software will handle .w64 files - it's getting more common but there are still some programs that will not be able to open them, which needs to be borne in mind if you are collaborating on these files with people using other software.

Mark

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: rraud

Date:4/28/2010 3:27:26 PM

I've never used it but, the *.frg is a SF project file, which allows "Undo's" past save. Saving the audio, as a wave, aiff or whatever, would render as a normal sized file. I assume the .frg file would not play in anything other than SF. or maybe other SCS app.s.
But then I could be full of beans and have the whole thing wrong.

Subject:RE: Save 24-bit, 96 KHz

Reply by: musicvid10

Date:4/28/2010 6:09:09 PM

You're real close. The .frg file does save the undo information, and is relatively small in itself. When you save the .frg file it creates a directory in the same folder that contains the last rendered version of your audio, which of course can get pretty large. Clicking on the .frg file loads the audio, project information, and redo information. Couple of times I wished I'd done this rather than destructively edit a take from Vegas.